Laura Bellamy

Speaker 1: Welcome to the secrets of success podcast, a series for recruiters, I recruiters I'm Danni Rainert. And in each episode, I have candid conversations about careers in recruitment, with some of the best talent that Team Eames has to offer. They'll be giving you a glimpse into the highs and lows of their recruitment, careers, their motivations, and drivers, and their secret to success in the industry. You can listen and subscribe on apple, Spotify, and other favorite podcast platforms. Let's meet our next guest.

Speaker 2: Good morning, Laura.

Speaker 3: How are you?

Speaker 2: I'm good. Thank you. How are you doing?

Speaker 3: Yeah. Good. Thank you.

Speaker 2: Thanks for coming on for our next session of secrets of success. Um, as you know, I'd be really keen to get you on because you do a slightly different role in the business at the moment. I'm so keen to kind of understand all about that, um, and get some real top tips from you today as well. Um, so yeah, thanks for joining. If you can, just for people listening and watching, give us a quick overview of your current role in the business and the market that you work in. That would be fantastic.

Speaker 3: Um, so I am a principal delivery consultant within aims, and I support one of our directors and partners, Mark Thomas across our senior technology and change hires in the market, um, predominantly insurance, but we also cover wider FS roles as well. Um, fairly new role for me. I recently moved into it and, um, well actually it's been a year now, God, it's a year now. Um, but yeah, loving it. It's new to a little bit different to what I did before, but that's what I do now.

Speaker 2: Fantastic. Thank you. And mark was actually our first ever guest on secrets of success. So people want to know a bit more about Mark they can see episode one, a little shameless plug there. Um, so let's take that kind of senior highest piece versus senior appointments, but it's all perm that you've focused on. Um, what, what is the difference that you've seen working in a senior end of the market, um, in comparison to the roles that you were doing before, which was, it was contract predominantly wasn't it and kind of mid to senior level Bas, BMs and PMOs that, that, that kind of changed space. So what's been the biggest difference that you've noticed working at the senior end of the market?

Speaker 3: Yeah, I think for me, it's very much at that senior level. Everyone who speaks to you is a hundred percent on the market. They are definitely looking for roles. They are always happy to engage in conversation. And I think the key thing is, is for them, it's also market knowledge as well. It is for me. So they speak to us on a, on a key basis because yes, they may be a looking, but also be what are their competitors doing out there in the market. If they was looking at hiring people, what, what would it look like for them? So it's very kind of two folds at the senior end it's relationship driven, but also us helping them as well as obviously them, them helping us. And hopefully I was placing them and it's kind of twofold.

Speaker 2: Yeah. That's what, you know, what, I hadn't actually thought of it like that before. You know, we always talk about the importance of being a subject matter expert, knowing your vertical market in order to build credibility with candidates and clients, and kind of have a really good conversation with them and make better matches in terms of placements. But you know what you're saying, there is that, that senior appointments. So we're actually acting as a partner, almost with those guys to give them knowledge and information that they can use in their role in terms of our insights in the market. Fantastic. Okay. Lovely. Um, and obviously you work on the delivery side at the moment and have done since you joined deep. So you joined deans for outside and a half years ago, is it now

:: 2016

Speaker 2: Fantastic. So what, what does it mean to be in a delivery box? Different people call it different things, don't they? So give me an overview of your role in delivery and kind of what your key responsibilities and deliverables are. Yeah,

Speaker 3: Sure. So for me, I think it's, it's the first thing is being well-connected within the market kind of knowing your candidates like the back of your hand, basically. Um, so for us, it's, it's something that a job comes in and in the first kind of five seconds, you've instantly got three to five people that you can call off it's then utilizing your network out of the back of that. But it's also just generally staying in touch with the market. There's, there's different elements to the delivery world where naturally you're reactive to roles that naturally come to us from our clients. But it's also about going out there and being proactive and talking to your clients and understand your candidates and understanding, okay, actually, where could that potentially be gaps in the market in terms of themselves or their own team, for example, that senior leadership, and that allows you to not just do that delivery part, but also work hand in hand with your, um, client consultant and help them pick up leads and pick up roles. So it's kind of two folds. Yes, you're delivering to, to active roles, but actually you also, you're, you're supporting your 360 clients or your current consultants and helping to pick up leads from the market and generate in business that way also. Yeah,

Speaker 2: Absolutely. Cause I think one of the common misconceptions is one delivery is kind of a, an entry level position and a junior role. And then you naturally, everybody moves on to 360 and, and doing business development, which isn't the case you've made a very successful career and, you know, not shy about it, made some great money and everything from being a delivery consultant, especially at your level. I think the other misconception is that if you're in a delivery role, you have no kind of influence over the jobs you work or business development or client work and stuff like that. But what, what you just mentioned there around picking up leads, and I know when you speak to your senior candidates, you obviously always, you know, could this be a client in the future? So there's still that kind of sales business development mentality in the back. Even if it's not you picking up the phone and converting a lead or cold calling a client, am I right? Yeah. I think as a

Speaker 3: Recruiter, you're naturally very inquisitive, right? So when you're having these calls and these conversations, you always find it. Okay. That, there's something that, let me find out a little bit more about it. They're talking about, okay, maybe we're a little behind on projects. Well, why are you behind on projects? Do you need some extra resource? So it's constant, Nate's being inquisitive and that expert and obviously candidates are very, they would love to talk to you about them sort of things. And I think that kind of thought the heart of what you do in a lot of instincts because they can give you everything from Rudy, the ground upwards. So yeah, a hundred percent, a super helpful, um, element to all aspects of the recruitment life cycle. Yeah.

Speaker 2: Um, do you also reference kind of the client consultants or 360? Because again, people will do different things. Some people are in a sort of a pure play BD role, like mark, who you work with, he brings in the jobs and then, and you find the candidates and then you kind of manage that process together. But you talk about your kind of counterpart there in, in whatever way, shape or form. How important is that relationship between delivery consultant and client consultants?

Speaker 3: Yeah, it's, it's a hundred percent, but one trust. It has to be trust driven. I think to, to the full extent, um, from, I guess Mark's point of view, he has to know that he can put his reputation on the line when it comes to picking up senior leadership roles and promising some pretty big people in big organizations that we can deliver that when actually him delivering on it, it's it's myself and partnership on that. So he has to be able to trust that I have the network to be able to do that. And equally I don't have to trust that Mark's getting all the right information that I need to go out to the market and sell the organization the opportunity, um, not just obviously for the candidate's sake, but also the organization who's hiring stake. Um, so it's, it's definitely trust belt. Um, you need to know how each other likes to work regular catch up calls me and mark catch up sort of three times over video call. And then we sit next to each other and just don't stop talking about what's going on and he can talk and I could give him a run for his money as well.

Speaker 2: Excellent stuff. Um, um, being I imagined in a temporary role, you know, as I say, you've got a lot of Kansas to track and it's being organized. Um, really, you know, I'm, I'm being quite methodical in what you do and organized in how you store your data and everything. And you can say information, is that, is that very important as well in order to be successful?

Speaker 3: Definitely. Yeah. I think the organization is key from a very, very early point in your career who starts playing if I don't have, if I don't know if I'm not on top of this, I, it, everything will fall through the cracks. There'll be cases where you have a role come up and you're against another agency, for example, and you haven't knocked something or you haven't taken note of something that will, that will be the one time that you lose a role because you wasn't organized and you didn't have something in place. So organization is key. You have to be have all of the stuff that you do nail down to a tape. Naturally it requirements about being flexible, right. As well. Yeah. As long as you've got the right tool set in front of you and you utilize it to the best of your capabilities every time, um, it's a pretty foolproof plan most of the time.

Speaker 2: Absolutely fab. Um, what was it about the delivery, um, kind of career path that drew you to it and what, why did you decide to go down that road?

Speaker 3: Yeah. And so I, in the first instance, I wanted to become an absolute expert in what I did in the market before I went out to try and sell my services in an, in another way. So I can help you with your problems when actually in maybe for the first year or so, I will still learn and what problems existed in the market without talking to candidates. And naturally from there, I just kind of fell into it. I built up so many relationships with candidates, um, and it was like, well, this just, this just works. I like this element of it. I really kind of I'm well known in the marketplace now in this elements things. And it just flowed very nicely. And then there was an opportunity that came up in my team for someone to fully stay within that position. And that's when, as an organization, I think we started to really kind of carve out different positions for delivery and client consultants. And I think from that point it's been super successful for us is finding people's strengths, weaknesses while they like to do what they don't like to do. And I think that's, what's great about aims is they were able to create two different roles for people that actually, maybe they don't want element of it, or maybe they don't want another element. Um, so that is why I did it. Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 2: So really great explanation of it. I think eons have been on a journey with that and we we've kind of changed the job spec a bit over the years, haven't we and the focus and how it's targeted out to remunerate the role, et cetera. So it was kind of a bit of a work in progress and we, people like you that were very patient and, you know, working hard and Anna's very much been on that journey with us. And now we have very clear established role profiles for each. It feels like the industry. I mean, I think Em's was doing it maybe, you know, at really good time and, and got in there early, which is great, but it feels like now when you speak to our competitors and other agencies and stuff, but actually the role of a delivery consultant is, is a very valid career path. And one that more and more agencies are creating within their, within their business.

Speaker 3: Uh, a hundred percent. I don't think when I joined, I never heard of it for me. It was always like, you go in, you learn the basics and then bam, 360, you started working, can you go straight into 360? And I was like, wow, that's very daunting actually. Um, and then all of a sudden there was all these options that actually, you know, what, you don't have to do the full 360 element. If you don't want to, if you're better at that side, you can do it. And then you start seeing it popping up everywhere because it's, it's very, it's a quick to market way of doing it. It's very, you get specialists in that areas. And that's what makes us great is we have specialists and they worked their skills. Um, and I think that's where people started to catch on to actually that is a, it's a great way of doing it. So just push forward with it.

Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely playing people to their strengths is, is always going to be a good win. Isn't it. And I think what it'll help with hopefully is to stop so much attrition in recruitment as an industry. It's quite transient industry. You see people kind of jumping around a bit. I did it in the early days. Um, and, and hopefully by having these different job roles now where people don't have to do the 360, if that I wanted would be more comfortable and more confident, more engaged in the role that they're doing, because let's face it. If we tried to shoe horn you into a three-sixty role four years ago, you might not still be here, but yeah,

Speaker 3: I think I would have run a mile.

Speaker 2: Well, the funny thing is that it's kind of come full circle, hasn't it? Because the kind of, I suppose, breaking news for us men not necessarily to be watching, but, um, for us is that you are going to move into a 360 world in January aren't yet, which is really exciting.

Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah. I am. I'm super excited. And I think the decision for me was I got to a point where I'd obviously done that delivery piece on a contract level within the insurance market across change management, and then stepped into that senior leadership piece where I was working alongside mark learning the technology market as well. Um, and I got to a point where I was like, actually speaking to the senior leadership people. It isn't a scariest, but it seems, and I think go out and I think I have quite some wide established relationships in the market now that I can utilize. And I, I think obviously working closely with mark, he is absolutely excellent and wants to go and go and listen to podcast one and watch that because he is at sort of the next year and you learn so much. And I think that in itself has been quite a big driver for me to go, you know what I can do that there's leaders, there's leaders that you can look up to, you can learn from you see on a daily basis. It's not as scary as it seems. So yeah. Shameless, pop, familiar to be any latest relationship with

Speaker 2: You're lucky you're born 360 records clearly. Um, so that's fantastic. And I think the story there, as well, as, you know, for people watching, I'm sure they would have picked up on it already is that, you know, just because you've chosen one path in recruitment or in anything in life doesn't mean you can't, you know, get to the top of that reevaluate and then throw yourself into a new challenge. And, you know, you could very easily stay as a principal, senior principal, et cetera, et cetera, within the delivery side of the business, you know, continue good earnings, feel very comfortable and constant in what you're doing every day. But you know, at your level you're saying, I want a new challenge and I'm just delighted that we've been able to, you know, create that opportunity at evens for you rather than you, you know, having to go somewhere else to find that. So I think it's an important lesson for everybody of kind of taking accountability for your own career, your own future, your performance, challenging yourself through us, out of your comfort zone. A even if you've been in recruitment, you know, five, six years like you have,

Speaker 3: I always make things out there. Right. And I think that's what, that's, what it is with recruitment is, is constantly, I've said it before, and I'll say it again. It's just being a sponge and taking absolutely everything. And that will always be something that interest you learning, having someone new, joining the team that they teach you something that actually, I never thought about it that way. There's two things. There's always new trends. There's always something happening. And so it's nice to keep it positive, keep it changing, keep it fluid really. And I think that's what keeps you interested in everything across your life, right? If things stay stagnant in the same, sometimes you can get fed up of it and potentially it's, it's not what you're doing. It's just maybe how you're doing it, or there's a little bit change that you can make. So yeah, I would definitely, if someone's feeling maybe a little bit stagnant or anything is, is look and say, how can I further challenge myself and put myself out of my comfort zone because that's where growth comes, right? It's constantly putting yourself out of your comfort zone. Absolutely

Speaker 2: Fantastic. So a mixture of excited and nervous about 20, 22, a new role.

Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah. It's one of them new year. New me starts as an outcome going in January. My notebooks, my highlight.

Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean with diet, for me, that finishes by about mid Jan. Um, but I'm sure you'll be incredibly successful. Um, final note, final question for me, we've talked a lot about you as an experienced hire and it, but you know, you did start from the beginning like everybody does, and that you've had a very brief stint a couple of months before reams didn't yet, but you basically started and, and, and grow new career aims. We've we've got quite few ACS entry level guys in the business at the time and associate consultants. What would your advice be to anybody thinking about starting a career in recruitment and making that first six to 12 months as successful as possible, because that's a really tough period for ACS and there's a lot of people that kind of try it and then decide it's not for me. And w what would your top tips be for those guys starting in recruitment? Yeah, I think that

Speaker 3: It's probably a few, I think you need to, um, you need to put your own time and your own effort into it as well. I think, I think you need to want to want to learn and this role, um, it's recruitment is probably, uh, it's a, it's a sales role, right? So it's not always going to be comfortable. It's not always going to be easy. You need to be tenacious. You need to be able to go up, get a little bit knocked back, actually go, you know what I've learned X, Y, Z from this, and this is how I'm gonna move forward in the future. Um, you need to work with the people that are around you, your team is so important. And I don't think I would get through some of the days that I'd got from recruitment. If I didn't work with the team that I do so surrounding yourself with good people and good leaders, and really just taking it, everyone is there to help you. I think so ask as many questions as you can. No question is a stupid question, um, at all. Um, and then just invested in your own learning, I think is, is really key.

Speaker 2: Um, yeah, that's fantastic. Great advice for people to take away. Well done. Lovely, Laura, that's all my questions for today. Thank you so much for taking the time. I think there's some great stuff that everybody to take away from that session. Perfect. Thanks for having me, darling. Have a good day. Bye.